Erica: Hey, girl. By now, you know I have Her Collective, my online community for ambitious women who are done doing it alone. Her Collective is for the women who are smart, capable, and driven, but they find themselves stuck on the sticky floors like self doubt, burnout, and waiting for permission that quite honestly never comes. Inside HER, you get more than motivation. You get real support, real strategies, and real momentum.

Erica: We work on things like clarifying what you want now and what's coming next, building confidence without burning yourself out, navigating hard conversations, career moves, and leadership moments with clarity, and surrounding yourself with women who actually get it. This isn't about hustling harder. It's about moving intentionally with the right tools and the right people in your corner. If you're ready to stop spinning, start choosing yourself, and build a career in life that actually feels aligned, I'd love to welcome you inside her collective. You can learn more and join us at www.joinhercollective.com.

Erica: Because, honestly, girl, you were never meant to do this alone.

Emily: It's brave to leave an organization and find a new job, but it's sometimes braver to stay and do it the right way, which is exactly what I did. I stayed in an organization where I wanted to blame everyone else.

Erica: Hello. Hello. Hello. So today, you are in for a treat. I have Emily Hawkins who almost six years ago left corporate America to start her own business. She helps business leaders leverage their time and their team so that they can profitably scale without working fourteen hour days. And I don't know about you, but I could sure use that.

Erica: So, Emily, welcome. It's so good to have you.

Emily: Hi. I'm so excited to be here. Thank you so much for inviting me.

Erica: Absolutely. So let's dive in because you had an amazing corporate career, a good gig going on. Right? And you left all of that to start your own business. Can you tell me kinda what led you up to making that bold move?

Emily: Oh, yes. Okay. So I love that you said amazing career because I think we all know that every day is not amazing. Exactly. And that was actually it was the everydays that were not amazing that led me to leaving, but I wanna explain this.

Emily: So in 2015 in February 2015, I gave birth to my second child, my son, and I just thought this is gonna be the best year. I'm gonna have the most amazing year. Well, I left for maternity leave, did not take the full twelve weeks because I was dedicated to my job. And I wanted to make sure that everyone knew I was dedicated to my job, so I ended up taking about eight weeks. Looking back, terrible decision, but I digress.

Emily: I got back, and the person that had been managing my team had just let them kinda do whatever they wanted. So they were coming in late. They were leaving early. And by the way, I had hired people right before I left in a rush. Never hire people in a rush.

Emily: Bad idea. And so with all the things going in motion to I hire these people. They come in. There's really no structure. There's no accountability.

Emily: Come and go as you want. And I come back. Our I was over, actually, our inventory, our in stock rates are in shambles. So that means our emails are just crazy.

Erica: Yeah.

Emily: And so my initial thought was, let me just put down the iron fist and micromanage the hell out of this. For anybody who's listening, that never works. And so, that was a terrible idea and did not do anything. So then, within about, I don't know, four weeks of deciding that wasn't working, I pulled all the way back and decided to be everyone's friend. Also not the answer.

Emily: I've also made everyone aware that I am clearly passive aggressive. Right? So just setting up this toxic environment. Right? I basically did everything wrong that you can think of.

Emily: Blaming, shaming, not taking any sort of ownership for anything that was going on, telling everyone that I was the victim. Why is my team so bad? What is it there? You know, what is that? And I, at the same time, decided to go down a journey of figuring out why this was happening.

Emily: I wanted to change everybody on my team. So I over the course of, I guess it was, like, eight months, I read about 26 different books on leadership. And by the way, spoiler alert, all of them, the end is you are the owner of all the things in your life. It took me 26 of these books to figure that out. Slow learner.

Emily: So I'm realizing this. Every book I'm getting a little nugget. Right? But I'm not getting the answer. I'm doing air quotes here.

Emily: Just for anybody who is looking for a book or anything like that, just know you're gonna get a great nugget. It is not going to solve everything in your life. And but after reading 26 of them, I started to see a pattern and things I wanted to shift and things I wanted to change. But the thing that really the straw that broke the camel's back was, it was this time of year. It was December of that same year when I decided to host a Christmas party for my team at my house, and nobody showed.

Erica: So the team that we went from micromanaging Mhmm. To then being the bestie.

Emily: -huh. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Just setting the

Erica: stage here in my mind.

Emily: Yep. Exactly. So they, like, don't really like me, but it was solidified when I hosted a Christmas party at my house and no one showed up.

Erica: Oh, wow. Mhmm.

Emily: I invited other people, other team members, my boss, all of those people showed up. But it's really embarrassing when your entire team of seven people do not show up.

Erica: Yeah. I mean,

Emily: not a single one of them. It was really telling. And I remember the next morning, it was a Saturday morning, just I work out in my basement. I do on demand workouts. So I'm in the basement, and I'm, like, plugging in my workout.

Emily: And I just lay on the floor, and I'm just bawling. Yeah. And I turned on a workout. It was actually Shaun T, by the way. The only reason that matters is because somewhere in the workout, he was like, get up.

Emily: You own your life. And I was like, oh, that's divine intervention. So I was like, you know what? I do. And I own who I am.

Emily: And so I ended up, also getting really frustrated with this team and writing a dream employee document. Yep. And this document was everything that I wanted these people to be, and it was all positives. Because negatives I mean, I could say I don't want them to be late. I don't want them to do that, but that's not specific.

Emily: So I got specific. And after I looked at this document, I had a sobering thought that if these dream employees showed up, who did I need to be to lead them? Because it was not who I currently was. And so I had the opportunity. I fired one person.

Emily: Two different people left the organization. And I thought, you know, I have a really unique opportunity to just turn over a new leaf, and this was in January 2016. So I took that dream document, hired based on that, really looking for the right fit for the team, spending more time on that, writing better job descriptions, but then really getting to know the people that I interviewed with found three rock stars. I mean, rock stars. And they didn't know they were rock stars, but they totally were.

Emily: And I decided to pretend like the team was onboarding. So, like, the entire team was onboarding. And so I had a couple people in different offices, so I flew everyone in. We spent a week pretending like we had never worked together, what everybody's strengths were, what everybody's weaknesses were. I had every single department come to that conference room and tell them what they do, what they hate to see from my organization, what they would love to see from my organization.

Emily: And one of the more seasoned members came to me after that and was like, this was excellent. This was, like, the most amazing thing. And I said, well, we're not done because every week we're gonna continue a cadence where we're learning together, we're growing together. We can talk about our failures. We can talk about our successes.

Emily: And for the members that had been a part of the team and the members that were new, it was like the new people were like, oh, Emily's great. And the new people were like, you have no idea what we have been through. But they were so I mean, I apologize to them. And within about ninety days of that meeting, we were the most productive team in the company. Wow.

Emily: And it was awesome. I mean, it wasn't that I had great employees. It was that I had built my own leadership team. People that felt comfortable sharing with me their ideas, questions that they had, how can we improve this, challenging me when I came up with ideas. And every leader needs to be challenged.

Emily: You really do. If you're not challenged in some way, if everybody on your team is a yes man, it's gonna be dangerous. Every idea you have is not great. Yeah. And so that just was wonderful.

Emily: But to be perfectly honest, I got bored because I had nothing to do. I started taking Fridays off because I could work four day weeks because my team was killing it, just doing so well. And they loved what they did. We had meetings. They started telling other people in the company, oh my gosh.

Emily: If you want a plan for your career, you should go talk to Emily. And so I started helping other people in the company with their careers, and then it felt like I was taking money, from the company. And what I mean by that is they hired me to manage inventory. I was doing it in two countries flying overseas and standing up global organizations when needed, and that was not what I was doing on a daily basis. And so I started to dream.

Emily: What if I helped a 100 people outside of the walls that were so protected to me? Like, I just felt like I can do whatever I want here. I'm safe. But what if I did it on my own and I didn't work with these people? And so I left in 2017.

Emily: I've helped 2,500 people, and I had such a small dream is what I realized. And one of the things I did was streamlining the hiring process, from the employee perspective. How do you get better jobs? Well, you gotta show up a lot better. And so I've taught a lot of that, but then my true dream is it's brave to leave an organization and find a new job, but it's sometimes braver to stay and do it the right way, which is exactly what I did.

Emily: I stayed in an organization where I wanted to blame everyone else.

Erica: Hey there, listeners. If you have ever felt like you're stuck in a place, held back by self doubt, perfectionism, or that pesky inner critic, you're not alone. We all face those sticky floors that keep us from reaching the heights we dream of. But guess what? It's time to shatter those limiting beliefs and toxic behaviors to uncover infinite possibilities.

Erica: My book, Glass Ceilings and Sticky Floors, is your ultimate guide to smashing through barriers, overcoming limiting beliefs, and stepping into your full potential. This book has been endorsed by none other than the great Mel Robbins, best selling author and motivational powerhouse. It's also been featured in Success Magazine, so you know it's packed with insights that work. Inside, you'll find real life sticky floor stories, practical strategies to help you navigate your own sticky floor moments, and a whole lot of inspiration to keep you climbing. This isn't just a book.

Erica: It's your roadmap to success, confidence, and freedom. Grab your copy of Glass Ceilings and Sticky Floors today at www.ericaandersonrooney.com. Whether you're in the boardroom, the classroom, or just starting out, this book is for you because no one, and I mean no one, deserves to stay stuck, no one deserves to feel small, and you have glass ceilings to shatter. Let's do this. Yeah.

Erica: It's absolutely easier, I think. It would have been easier when you recognize that, wow. I have this team of seven. Not a single one of them showed up to my party. My boss was there.

Erica: They saw that. Like, I've just gotta go. I've gotta jump ship. So absolutely kudos to you for making the decision to stay. And I feel like when I hear this story, number one, it's an amazing story.

Erica: But number two, I hear about how you're kind of stuck in this mindset of, like, the blame and the shame. It's my team's fault. They're acting this way. How did you, I mean, get out of that sticky floor of the blame and the shaming of other people and move more towards that ownership and accountability?

Emily: Well, it was one part reading all of those books because all of them. Yeah. All of them were like, you own this. The first book I read, I remember saying to myself, what a bunch of crap. Like, for real?

Emily: Like, it's all me? Like, this book is so unhelpful. Looking back, it was an incredibly insightful, wonderful book that I was not ready to hear. I was not ready to see. Right?

Emily: And I remember talking to our head of sales, and I was complaining to him about my team. And I was looking for a sympathetic ear. This man is one of the nicest people I've ever met on the planet. And but he's also very direct. And he said, well, the common denominator with every employee not performing well would be their boss.

Emily: And I was like, oh. And it really stuck with me, in terms of, he's right. You know? It's like the thing I didn't wanna wanna see, but it I have to say, unfortunately, it was a lot of different things. It was reading these books.

Emily: It was that conversation, and it was people not showing up to my party. It was like, oh, it was I what is it that's saying? It's like when you're not paying attention, you get tapped on the shoulder, and then you get pushed a little bit. And then if you're still not listening to what the universe is telling you, you get knocked over. I am one of those people that apparently you have to knock me over Wow.

Emily: For me to understand what's going on.

Erica: Yeah. I can imagine that's a lot, though. You know, you've come back from maternity leave early at that, you know, and you're you've made decisions where you hired in a rush and all that, and you're just you've got a lot on your plate. And so I can totally understand how easily that kind of situation can spiral. Right?

Erica: Mhmm. How did you go about making the amends with the team members who stayed?

Emily: So I told them we're starting over. And when I say we, I mean me. I have not led well. Yeah. I have let you down.

Emily: And it is my duty as the leader of this team to make this better, to make your job easier. I am here to support you. And I actually I had also been listening to TED Talks on my way home from work, and there was this one amazing TED Talk, and it was about chaos, actually. And what was so wonderful was our team was some people knew each other, obviously, the people that were still on the team, and then we were bringing in these new people. And it was talking about that in groups where you don't know people, you make better decisions and how you can organize what seems like chaos easier with people you don't know.

Emily: And so I was like, this is what we're starting with. And, so the actual at the very beginning of this TED talk talks about this amazing story, about this man who was asked to play a concert, and it was by this young girl. I think she was 16, and it was in, like, the Cologne Opera House in Germany. And he was asked to play. He's a famous jazz pianist, and she had gotten him to come over, which was amazing.

Emily: But he showed up, and the piano was out of tune. It was missing keys. Mhmm. The felt was worn off. So even if you play it, you have to play it kinda hard to get the key to actually play.

Emily: Mhmm. And he said to her, like, I can't play this. And she followed him outside into the rain, and she said, I will do anything if you make this work. And he said, I just remember looking at her in the pouring rain, and I and I just said to her, like, for you okay. So this famous jazz pianist says to her, I'll do it.

Emily: Comes back the next day. They got a tuner, a piano tuner, but, like, the piano was very sad. So it's not like that helped a whole lot. But this man, he ended up avoiding the notes that didn't work, playing harder on the keys that the felt was worn off. And it actually was and still to this day is the highest selling jazz musician album, live piano album of all time.

Emily: It's, the Cologne Opera House. It's beautiful, by the way. And for you to hear this album and realize how broken that piano was and how beautiful he makes it sound and how intuitive he is, and it's so beautiful. And so I sent that to everybody because it was like, we're playing a broken piano here, and it's up to all of us to use our strengths to play harder when we need to play harder and maybe play a little softer or miss some keys when things aren't working. And so that was really my starting off point of, like, it's gonna be a crazy year when we start out because I remember sending everybody this in December.

Emily: And I it took a lot of the rebuilding that trust, because that's the thing is trust takes a lot of time to build, and it takes about a second to lose. And so it was, yeah, it was a period of time, but then after that and after seeing how that meeting went where every group came and talked, they started to realize this is very different than what we were doing before.

Erica: Yeah. I think one of the biggest lessons too is that accountability is, in my opinion, the single characteristic that determines success. Right? And you could have sat there for however long and said it's them. It's them.

Erica: It's them. It's them. It's them. It's not me. You know?

Erica: And you could have done that on repeat. And it might have been some of them. You know? Like, that's a very real thing, but, like, we can only can control what is in our control. Right?

Erica: We can't control what other people think. We can't control how they perceive us. They we can't control how they act. And so for you to sit there and look at this picture and say, okay. I need to take accountability by controlling how I lead, by controlling how I show up for my team, and how I am going to start this team over, right, was huge because you could, again, have said, I'm gonna control the situation by leaving and bouncing out.

Erica: You know? But you took that chance with your team, and you really laid it all out there. Right? Which is, like, vulnerability, accountability, owning your own shame, owning your own blame in the situation. And then it's up to your team to make a decision if they wanna stay or if they wanna go.

Erica: You

Emily: know? Yeah. So to me,

Erica: it's That's accountability.

Emily: Well and flash forward to when I did decide to leave, to open my own business, I did not wanna tell my team. It was like that was the only part of it that was like it was like the end of, at the end of The Wizard of Oz when she's saying goodbye to everybody and they're all her friends. And it was like, you were the ones who helped me see my gifts. You know? And so I'm I have zero problem telling anyone else in the company.

Emily: Right? I'm like, I'm so excited. I'm doing this thing. And then I have a meeting. I mean, I tell my team before I tell the rest of the organization, but I could not hold it together.

Emily: Could not hold it together. So through, like, sobbing, basically, I'm telling them, you know, how they awakened me and made me a better person. And one guy stops. He's like, stop. Just stop.

Emily: And I was like, oh god. What's gonna happen?

Erica: Having this conversation? Yeah.

Emily: That's what I was worried was not happening. And then he tells me about how much better I made him as an individual and how I had strengthened him and made him better. And then somebody else interrupts him and shares their story of how I had helped them. And then somebody else interrupts. And by the way, these are all men except for one.

Emily: So I have one female and all men. We are all crying at this point. And I was like, this is how I know I'm making the right decision because I need I need to touch more people with this gift of empowerment. Right? Mhmm.

Emily: Because all they did is get the chance to look in the mirror and see their amazing gifts and talents. So let me ask you a question. When you're looking back at this, it's an amazing story.

Erica: You know, before you kind of had that moment where you were like, okay. This this really is up to me. How would you name that sticky floor now looking back?

Emily: Fear. Fear. It was a 100% fear. Fear of I'm not enough. I'm not good enough.

Emily: I'm not smart enough. And it's funny because it actually had nothing to do with that looking back. Had zero to do with that. Mhmm.

Erica: So my next question for you, it's kind of like a two parter, but the first part. Right? So you had this fear of I am not enough. Right? And you conquered that.

Erica: So do you feel like we're out of this sticky floor of the fear of I am not enough, or do you feel like that is still reoccurring at any point in your life?

Emily: Oh, that's so interesting. I recently did some work on that because I think it does rear its ugly head, periodically, but what I will tell you is that means you're doing something new and fun. And if you're not feeling it regularly, then you're probably not challenging yourself enough. And so what I say now is I don't have all the answers yet. Yet is a very powerful word that sometimes we forget actually exists in the, you know, English language.

Emily: And when you think about it, you are any day of the week. You have the opportunity to learn something new, open your mind. And something that I find myself having to say is keep your heart open. And I'm saying it to myself all the time. Keep your heart open.

Emily: Because when we close our heart, it's like a defense mechanism. Right? And maybe we keep somebody from, I don't know, taking our bank account or something crazy like that. Right? But if you stay like that all the time, you miss all the beauty around you and lessons from, you know, people that you work with, from neighbors, from friends, from spouses.

Emily: You miss all of that. So when you close your heart, you're you can't just pick and choose what you're closing your heart to. You actually close it to everything. And so I'd rather keep my heart open, but you can keep your heart open and stay logical. Right?

Emily: Yeah. And I think that's where we go a little wrong. If if you're ever in a meeting where you find yourself saying, I've heard this before. I know this thing. Keep your heart open.

Emily: There is something in that moment that you haven't heard before. There's somebody's opinion you haven't heard before. And on the other side of that is an opportunity to do something very big, but you only see it if you keep your heart open. And so for me, it's keep your heart open and no. I don't know the answer yet.

Erica: Such a powerful statement because especially for women who experience this imposter syndrome or this feeling like I can't, you know, or I don't know and it holds us back, right, is that I haven't done this yet. And keep in mind, like, none of us have done everything. You know? And I recently heard a podcast. I can't remember which one, but it was talking about how children are so good at this because they suck at literally everything.

Erica: Right? They can't walk. They can't talk. They can't feed themselves. You know?

Erica: They can't do anything, yet they keep trying. And if we watch them, these children learn how to do all of these things. Right? So we can too. We just have to not only keep our heart open, but also keep our mind open that it may take a while.

Erica: Right?

Emily: It's such a powerful statement because it's not that you can't. It's just that you haven't yet. Well, you mentioned something that just made me think about this. We raise our children sometimes the wrong way. Meaning, okay.

Emily: Your child does something, and you're like, oh, you're so smart. Mhmm. You're labeling them when that's not helpful. It's not helpful to your team either because you might say, oh my gosh, Sarah. You're so smart for coming up with this thing.

Emily: Right? It's not that she's smart. It's that she has a great thought process. Mhmm. That is an action that somebody can continue to do over and over and over again.

Emily: A label is not something you can do over and over and over again. I'm not gonna walk into a meeting and say, well, my boss said I was smart. Mhmm. That's not helpful to anyone. But if I'm like, oh, I remember when my boss told me I had a great thought process, So I'm gonna use that here.

Erica: Yeah.

Emily: And then you use it. So it's like when you give your children the actions that they do that you're really proud of. I love how in my family, I always say two things. I love your thought process, and I love how resourceful you are. I love how my children think through something, and I constantly praise that because I'm like, there's gonna be a day when I'm not here anymore, and they need to know how to think through something that feels hard.

Emily: And that's the same with your employees. You if you wanna go on a business trip, you wanna take time off, they need to be able to think through hard without you being there. And so praising the right actions is way better than just saying, you are so smart. You are so nice. Like, that's great.

Emily: Don't get me wrong. Those are great things. But it you're not you're not giving them any feedback as to why that is Yeah. The the way it is.

Erica: What's so interesting to me on this one is that's something that I absolutely do with my children. Like, I talk to them a lot about how hard they work because these are hard things and we can do hard things. But I've never flipped the script and done it with my employees in that way. So I'll have to that'll be my big takeaway from today. What sticky floors do you feel like you struggle now that you're a successful business owner, you're out of the corporate world, like, are they rearing their heads in different ways?

Emily: Oh, that's so interesting. Okay. So I am an upholder. An upholder is somebody who loves to follow rules. The greatest example of this is I have been to, I don't know, probably thousands of different pools in my life.

Emily: Mhmm. Like, you go to a hotel, there's a pool. You go to somebody's neighborhood, there's a pool. You, you know, go to the beach, and they have a little pool at their resort. At every single pool, they have rules written.

Erica: I was like, are you the person that always showers before you get in the pool?

Emily: Actually, I don't.

Erica: Even when I know that

Emily: is totally a rule. Oh my gosh. Maybe I am, like, not, but you're right. I'm the person who reads the rules Mhmm. Every time.

Emily: By the way, they're never different. Right? There's not like some pool in Guam that says something different, just maybe in another language. It's all the same, but for some reason, I'm like, we better read the rules. And what's interesting as a business owner is you get to write the rules.

Emily: And so periodically, I meet with my team usually about every six months to kill sacred cows and to also burn my boats. And what I mean by that is, what got me here will not get me there. And so there are things when I started my business, for instance, I started my business. I was a party of one. Right?

Emily: So I was marketing, sales, you know, fulfillment, like, all the things, writing the emails. I needed to learn those systems so that then I could teach others how to do that. And so every six months, I have to reevaluate what have I been doing that no longer makes sense for me to do? What have I mastered, and what can I now hand off, and who is interested in taking it?

Erica: Yeah. Well, where can people find you if they're interested in learning more or, you know, connecting with you?

Emily: Yeah. So, the best place to find me is, you can actually find me on all the social platforms, Emily Hawkins, the number four, the letter u. You can also go to my website, Emily Hawkins, the number four, the letter u. Well, thank you so much, Emily. Your story is

Erica: an amazing one. I think it's gonna connect with a ton of listeners. So thank you for being so open and vulnerable today. I appreciate it.

Emily: Thank you for having me.

Erica: Oh my gosh. Emily is just doing amazing things, and I enjoyed her story, especially the tragedy of the Christmas party. And if you enjoyed this story as much as I did, please be sure to rate, review, and subscribe to the show as it truly helps the podcast get into the hands of the woman who needs to hear it today.