Erica: Hey, girl. By now, you know I have Her Collective, my online community for ambitious women who are done doing it alone. Her Collective is for the women who are smart, capable, and driven, but they find themselves stuck on the sticky floors like self doubt, burnout, and waiting for permission that quite honestly never comes. Inside HER, you get more than motivation. You get real support, real strategies, and real momentum.

Erica: We work on things like clarifying what you want now and what's coming next, building confidence without burning yourself out, navigating hard conversations, career moves, and leadership moments with clarity, and surrounding yourself with women who actually get it. This isn't about hustling harder. It's about moving intentionally with the right tools and the right people in your corner. If you're ready to stop spinning, start choosing yourself, and build a career in life that actually feels aligned, I'd love to welcome you inside her collective. You can learn more and join us at www.joinhercollective.com.

Erica: Because honestly, girl, you were never meant to do this alone.

Erica: I'm your host, Erica Rooney. And today I am super excited to have with us long time friend and gal pal, Jenny Boyd. Now, let me tell y'all a little bit about Jenny. She is one of my favorite people and she and I met.

Erica: Over ten years ago, I would say with the junior league of Raleigh, but she is a badass successful woman and she has joined the new tech network, AKA NTN, almost a year ago or a little over a year ago to serve as the chief people and equity officer. So she's super passionate about fostering inclusion and continuing to expand the educational opportunities through NTN's mission. So Jenny, before that has led many people centric efforts at leadership for educational equity. She's worked for Teach For America, provided strategic consulting support for other nonprofit organizations and a ton more. I don't want to give away all of her secrets.

Erica: I'll let her speak to those, but she is a wife. She is a mom and she is working in Baltimore at this time. So Jenny welcome. It's so good to see you.

Jenny: Good to see you too. Thank you so much for inviting me to be a part of

Erica: this. Oh, I'm so glad it gives us the opportunity to connect again, but I would love to start off today with just hearing a little bit more about you and sharing that with our listeners.

Jenny: Yes. So I love that you mentioned that I am in Baltimore. I feel like in some ways I've come full circle. Started my career here in Baltimore, teaching seventh and eighth grade science. War in the downtown portion of Baltimore.

Jenny: But my partner recently received a job here at Johns Hopkins. So we're now closer to the campus of Hopkins. And I love being back in the Baltimore community and being a part of this city and the energy that it has. And I also feel really fortunate that I work in a role that is remote, that allows me to continuously search for some semblance of balance between work and family. Having three little ones, and I emphasize the little ones because I do think that they present both their own energy and excitement and challenges that having three with our oldest being four years old is where I'm at in my life right now, trying to keep up with the littles while also doing all that I can in my day to day professionally to support our staff, to feel that they really are cared for, that they belong and they really can thrive every day in the roles that they have.

Jenny: So that's a little bit about me.

Erica: I love it, Jenny. And yes, being a working professional mom, it's a lot, but you have three, which is it's not even hand to hand combat at this stage anymore. Well, awesome. So what I would like to start off with is talking about your sticky floor moment and what was that sticky floor for you?

Jenny: Yes. It's such a great question. I reflected on this because in reality, there's probably so many sticky moments and, the stickiness is also so layered. It's probably what makes it so sticky is that there is probably 10 layers deep of goo, which I'm also familiar with the three small kids. But when I reflected on this, I really landed on this value that I was taught at a very young age that actions speak louder than words.

Jenny: And in my professional life, that really was a limiting belief that I had in that I could just continue to work really, really hard that someone is, there was an assumption someone is paying attention to that and has the time to be looking at all of the actions that I've taken. And this statement of actions speak louder than words. It doesn't imply that nothing is being said, but I think I somehow convinced myself, oh, I don't need to say anything. My actions will almost speak for themselves. And so I would work, get up early in the morning work.

Jenny: I was that person who would work on their laptop until they fell asleep, sleep with my laptop under my pillow and just really had this belief that someone was going to notice that and that I didn't need to speak up. And it wasn't so much just about the actions, but it's about the impact of those actions. So I also don't want your listeners to think that it is about getting up early and staying up late, but I really did believe that the effort and work that I was putting in was creating the kind of impact for the organization that they would see. But I realized that words do matter. We do need to ask for what we need, what we want, what we choose to say and when matters.

Jenny: And I think that there's probably, your listeners are probably thinking that I'm coming from somewhere Southern and Baltimore's kind of Southern, maybe not quite so Southern. But that is to say, there's also this value of kind. And I did learn that clarity, directness, that could also be kind. That is not, there is nothing that says being direct and clear about what you want is less kind. If anything, it is more kind to everyone involved because it doesn't require everyone to spend additional time guessing what someone wants needs.

Jenny: So even though you said, what made it sticky? And I said, I would kind of point to one thing. I do feel like that it is so layered in that. So, yeah.

Erica: No, I love it. I mean, there definitely are many layers there, right? Like the first being the fact that you're killing yourself, sleeping with a laptop, doing all this work, waiting for someone to notice. Right. And there is the reality that there are other people who are probably doing a lot less than you probably leaving their laptop at the office, but raise their hand and speaking up and getting noticed more while you're kind of waiting in the wings being like, but I was working until 09:00 at night.

Erica: So I think that's really cool. But one thing that I think you said that I really loved was about the clarity and the directness, but also about being kind. And I think that we so often. When we do get those people who are being very clear and they are being direct, they often forget to be kind as well. Right.

Erica: And all of that needs to be wrapped up together because in general, people all want to do good work, you know, and they all want to add to the company's mission and vision and make an impact and make a difference. So when you go back to that real belief that, like, believe the best in people, like, keep that at the center and keep the kindness at the center of it all.

Jenny: Absolutely. So

Erica: how do you kind of instill that message? I mean, you're chief people and equity officer. How do you instill that message of clarity, directness, and kindness, like to your people in your organization?

Jenny: Yes. Well, I, for myself and for so many, I have found that reflecting on your best work experiences oftentimes remind us that in that there was clarity. And in that there was a sense of direction and there was a sense of care and kindness in that. And so I really do try to remind myself or remind our staff of when have you had those really great experiences and what did that look like? And on the flip hand side, when did you have experiences that could have been better?

Jenny: And there are oftentimes the antithesis of that. There was a lack of clarity. There were assumptions being made. Someone wasn't being kind and caring in that. And so really thinking about in our experiences that we have with one another, it is typically that combination of clarity and kindness that really gives us our best experiences with one another.

Jenny: And so how can we provide that for each other? And there is a I always think about it sounds cheesy, but I reflect on the love languages from time to time. And they oftentimes say with the love languages, you do the love language that you want to receive.

Erica: Yeah.

Jenny: And so I also think about that in that we should be exhibiting the behaviors that we also want to receive and we're modeling for other people, how they can do that. The more experiences that our staff have where they hear directness and it also feels caring and kind, then they are able to pay that forward in a way because they can point to those examples. Yeah.

Erica: I think we all grew up with the saying of treat others the way you would want to be treated. And I know there's been a lot of like discussion about no treat them the way they want to be treated. But I think there's a little happy median in there, right? Where there are some just very big, everyone wants to be treated kindly. Everyone wants to be spoken to in a respectful manner.

Erica: So I think finding that happy median between how they best want to be treated, their love languages, their communication styles, and same for you. So really cool. One thing you talked about and just I'm imagining you curled up and fed with your little laptop, like as a pillow, right? So you're snuggling away so you can wake right back up and do it all again. You can't do that when you're a mom.

Erica: Like there's no way around it. So how did you find balance and how did you get out of that sticky floor of just not really having a work life balance and just being so dedicated to your work, to managing family, but also a rise in career.

Jenny: Yes. I think over time, and this was before I had the children over time, I really realized the value of under promising and over delivering. And that is just to say, I think that there was a time in my career where I felt like if I could just say that I can do all of these things and really over promise and then deliver on those over promises that would be seen as achieving the kind of outcomes that the organization that I'm working for, that my colleagues are looking for. And it may not be under promising. Maybe it's just a bit of a reality check for oneself, but it there is something to recognizing and shaping your time in a way that you're not promising 110% of yourself out so that when those things arise that are unexpected, you're not at 130%.

Jenny: So what does it look like to promise out 70% of yourself and leave yourself 30% for the things that are unexpectedly going to add onto that. And so that you really, again, that clarity is kindness piece, so that there is no misunderstanding that I thought you were going to get a, b, c, d through z done. It's much more, oh, I knew you were prioritizing a, b, and c. And I knew that if you had time, you would get to these other things. And so I think that clarity is also for oneself and that kindness is to yourself to be kind to yourself and not so hard on yourself that you expect more than what really is realistic or really even, I would say beyond realistic evensable.

Jenny: Yeah.

Erica: Hey there, listeners. If you have ever felt like you're stuck in a place, held back by self doubt, perfectionism, or that pesky inner critic, you're not alone. We all face those sticky floors that keep us from reaching the heights we dream of. But guess what? It's time to shatter those limiting beliefs and toxic behaviors to uncover infinite possibilities.

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Jenny: I think

Erica: a big word that keeps popping up in my head, which is like a buzzword nowadays is for boundaries too. Right? Like setting those boundaries, because I think as women and especially as women are rising up to our careers, we have a major tendency to want to say yes to everything. Yes. I'll do that.

Erica: Yes. Put that on my plate. And we're just adding all of these responsibilities over promising and then time, time is time. We're not going to get more of it in a day. So how did you kind of go about setting those boundaries for yourself?

Erica: Right? Like making sure you knew when to say no or, when to ask for help and creating that time for yourself.

Jenny: Oh, well, I, I would not say that I am great at setting my own boundaries, but I would say there is a process that I've implemented for myself that I think has helped me really process through the work. And that has been when there is something that needs to be done, a reflection of who really is best suited to do this work. Because I think that oftentimes work can be routed to individuals for a wide variety of reasons. One is busy. Everyone has a lot on their plate that it may be fully thought through why you're being asked to do something.

Jenny: And it may be truly just a, a momentary. Well, let's just ask Erica or let's ask Jenny. And so I would say my process has helped me be better at setting boundaries in terms of really reflecting on, am I uniquely qualified and suited to do this work or could anyone do it? And then when I think about that even more, is it even that someone else could do it or could someone else actually even do it better than I could do it? And would my role really be as a creator of that?

Jenny: Or would I be a better editor reviewer? We utilize a structure where we work to be really clear about the roles that we all play with a wide variety of projects. I'm sure other organizations are using similar type structures where we get really clear on who's the owner, who's consulting, who's helping, who's approving that. And sometimes one individual can try to wear all of those hats. If something gets passed and they're like, okay, I'm going to create it and I'm going to review it myself and then I'm going to approve it myself.

Jenny: And so there really is a recognition that our best work is done more collaboratively and where we can bring in additional diverse perspectives into the work. And so what role should I play based upon what's going to make for the best outcome? So I would say don't have a great answer to how I've set up boundaries. More of an answer of how I've felt more about the work and my role in it. And in doing so, that has really made me far more efficient to where I don't need to sleep with my laptop because I know someone else is getting this started and I'm gonna review it the next morning.

Jenny: Or I have really clear ideas of who would be able to jump in on this and do a much better job than me just saying yes in a moment.

Erica: Now let me ask you a question.

Jenny: And then it because I

Erica: think it could go two different ways. Right? When you're talking about, should I do the work or should it be for someone else? Right. And our tendency is to want to initially say yes.

Erica: Do you think it's because from a control perspective, like I know a lot of people, sometimes myself struggle with like, I like things done a certain way, so it's just easier for me to do it. So there's that aspect of it. Or is it like truly the delegation piece of it? Like, I don't want to burden somebody by asking them to do it, so I'll just do it myself.

Jenny: Oh, that's a great question. I think that there was probably a time where I thought everything had a quote unquote right way of getting it done. Yeah. Or that there's like an optimized way and that optimized way was probably the way I was going to do it. And I've really learned that there are a lot of ways to do the work and be selective.

Jenny: There can still be those spaces where you are the, the answer can be in that process of reflection. I am the right person to do this. I should take this on. And that is okay too. It is more that I would say what drove me earlier in my career was a perfectionist kind of, there is a right way and let me get us on track to that right way.

Jenny: And this sense of urgency about work that may or may not be real, but I always felt very urgent. And to, to your point on delegation, there's the feelings that's ask someone else. It's also the time to ask them the time that it would take to explain to them the way that I think that they should do it, which is then a whole nother aspect that we can explore. I think that the time aspect too oftentimes wait, wait on me and I've realized there's actually much, much fewer things that are truly urgent than I once thought.

Erica: Yep. I'll tell you when you talked about perfectionist and then the sense of urgency, the sense of urgency one got me. And this is an area that, like, I try to work on a lot, especially honestly in my personal life and in my marriage, is this like when we're dealing with the kids. Right. Cause like, I have a certain way I do things with the kids and like, that's how everybody should do it.

Erica: So why is it my husband doing that? Like I'll use swim practice as one example. I'm like, you have to leave the house by this time and then you have to pick her up by this time and then you have to do X, Y, and Z. And so he's very like casual about it. He might get there five minutes late and I'm like, you can't be ready to swim.

Erica: And he's like, well, why not? Like nothing's happening. Like she's still swimming. And, and if I sit down and like, take a minute, then I'm like, yeah, it really, it really doesn't matter. It's like, it's not that urgent.

Erica: So like, why do I feel that like sense of urgency? And that could just be a me problem. I don't know if you experienced that either.

Jenny: Yes. Yes, of course. I, and I think that when you're not yet in a senior leadership role, I think that there can be this, and this can also be true when you are in a senior leadership role. Just the world is so dynamic right now. And I've found myself most recently reflecting on like how much of this is that to your swim practice example, that is something that I can control and I have voiceover.

Jenny: And there are aspects of our work and of our lives that we just, we feel less in control of. And so I think that there are aspects of like personal and professional that it could just be, this is something that I can actually say how it should be done. And I don't have a voice in everything right now. So I'm going to have a voice in this and you're going to hear me.

Erica: You're going to get to swim on time.

Jenny: Yes. Yes.

Erica: It's just so funny to me. He literally, he's just like, yeah, well, maybe we'll get there. Maybe we won't. Sometimes they don't even get there. I don't know.

Erica: But it is it's, it's giving up a little bit of that control, which is a very, for me, it's a very challenging thing. And it's a sticky floor that I work through. It's like having to, to balance that. But I love how you kind of put that perspective on it of this is something I can usually control. I usually can control that we are on time for doing all of these things.

Erica: Right. So it's kind of very interesting. So what kind of advice would you give to someone who's looking back at this? They are sleeping with their laptops. They're trying to find that work life balance.

Erica: And then also all of the other layers that you talked about. Right? Like, make sure that you're speaking up and that you're using the right words to advocate for yourself. What kind of advice would you give to people so that they can work through those sticky floors?

Jenny: Oh, goodness. I spent so much time in those hours that I was staying up late, getting up early. And I would think about all the things that I needed to work on. All the things that were areas of growth for me. And I would say no matter your role, no matter what you are doing, take some time to think about the things that you're doing well.

Jenny: How you can articulate those strengths to other people. So I think early in my career, I think the words that I, I would use were oftentimes focused on my areas of growth. I would say, oh, you're well, this is something that I'm working on. I'd love for you to continue to help me. I think that there was this idea that I would build relationship with staff that were more senior than me through a mentorship of the areas that I need to grow in.

Jenny: And I was, but I was spending proportionally. When you think about what percentage of time were you talking about that? I was talking about my areas of growth a lot. I was talking about my strengths very rarely. And that partially is a part of my identity and who I am and how I was raised.

Jenny: And I know your listeners cannot see me. So I feel like I have to say. As a Korean female that is Southern, that was taught that kindness looks a particular way of opening doors and stepping to the side. I would say just reflect on who you are in terms of our identity does matter. The skin that we live in does inform the way that we are being perceived by others.

Jenny: And all of our lived experiences will push us to different behaviors. And now that I've had more time to reflect, I really would say even in my very first day in my career, I had something to offer. There was something there in terms of strength. And I really do wish that I had focused earlier on how do I develop my strengths to be stronger than focusing so much. I mean, it probably benefited me, right.

Jenny: That I did focus on the areas of grief. But in the scheme of things, thinking about how can I think about my strengths a little bit more, because I do feel like that now in my position, it's a combination of that? I have honed my strengths and worked on my areas of growth. It wasn't just the focus on growing and learning in the deficit minded way that brought me

Erica: here. Yeah. I love that, because I do think it's very easy to just like focus in on our opportunities for growth. Right? Like that is what as a young kid, like, we're always like, you're doing really great in this, but like really need to work on this.

Erica: So from a very young age, we're always instilled of like, how can we be better? How do we be better instead of highlighting those areas where you're really like kicking butt and taking names and like, let's continue to do that and let's take it a step further. Right? Absolutely. How can you continue to play up your strengths?

Erica: And I think like that leads my brain to a whole other thing of like, just remembering from a mental standpoint that like, we're all different people and we are not going to be good at all the things.

Jenny: Right.

Erica: Cause sometimes you may have an opportunity of growth Then maybe you don't need to worry about, like, I don't need to be a mathematician numbers, all of that. That is not my strongest suit, but I am not the chief financial officer. I don't deal with a ton of numbers. I need to be able to do the basics. So continuing to work on the people skills that I'm great at and not worrying so much, not being so concerned about percents and dividing and all that good jazz.

Jenny: Ma'am, absolutely.

Erica: Cool. So what's next on the horizon for you, Jenny? What do you got coming up?

Jenny: Oh goodness. Well, I absolutely love the work that I'm doing in the day to day. And I will say I had a mentor years ago tell me, do not think too far ahead. This was at a point in my life where I was like, well, I think one day I may wanna have a family. So what should I decide to do now?

Jenny: And she said,

Erica: you don't even have a family right now. What are you talking about? Like

Jenny: think about what is right in front of you. And so that is just to say that advice has served me well. And so what is on the horizon is I am really focused on the things that are right in front of me, which are enjoying my day to day here at New Tech and really watching the organization grow and flourish and, and grow, really being grow its impact for kids and communities. And then the horizon is watching my kids start school. Our oldest will start school this fall and that's going to be another transition.

Jenny: And, and I think that if we have learned anything in this pandemic it has been that we don't know what's on the horizon. So I think that there is a piece for me of I'm ready for whatever is on the horizon. And I'm very much living here in the moment and appreciating what we have right now.

Erica: Oh, I love that. I love that. And I've said it before on this podcast, but, like, I have a quote on my board that is behind me that says, the beauty of uncertainty is infinite possibility.

Jenny: So, like, you don't need

Erica: to know everything that's laid out in front of you. You don't have to. I love that. Well, great. Well, Jenny, if somebody wanted to learn a little bit more about you or connect with you, where can they find you?

Jenny: Yes. I would recommend a LinkedIn. I don't know how common Jenny Boyd is, but I do utilize my maiden name as my middle name. So Jenny Pedicord Boyd. If you look for that, I know there is no other Jenny Pedicord Boyd out there.

Jenny: So LinkedIn is a great way. I'm also open to email. So my current email is jboyd at newtechnetwork dot org. And I love hearing from people, whether I, like, know them for the past decade or meeting them for the first time. So feel free to reach out.

Erica: Oh, wonderful. And I will share all of that in the show notes for the listeners. But, Jenny, it was so wonderful talking to you. Thank you so much for your time.

Jenny: Thank you, Erica.